Author Topic: Gilding – which size do you use and why?  (Read 21755 times)

Offline Inkysloth

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Re: Gilding – which size do you use and why?
« Reply #45 on: March 20, 2015, 02:21:52 PM »
I don't know what was going on with my browser, but I couldn't see any pictures last time I read this thread. There is beautiful work here - gives me hope that I'll get to grips with gilding... at some point!

Offline Faeleia

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Re: Gilding – which size do you use and why?
« Reply #46 on: April 12, 2018, 12:04:04 AM »
Hi my friendly and knowledgeable Calli Peeps, I'm sorry to revive such an old topic, but I've been having trouble with my instacoll.. Was so excited to get this until I realized it's difficult to use. I'm not getting my imitation leaves to stick well. I've tried several methods of waiting for it to dry for an hour (completely non sticky) breathing on it to attempt reviving (not effective). I've tried diluting it a little with distilled water, I've tried laying several layers on and the only tacky time I found worked was before it completely dried (like 15-20mins of waiting), but I don't like that because it kind of shrinks and wrinkles the leaf after it dries. I've tried hot press watercolour paper and cold press watercolour paper and they are the same. i don't turn the fan on when I lay the instacol or leave it to dry, but it's really humid and warm in Singapore.

I ordered real gold leaf thinking it may be because imitation gold are too thick, but I'm not too excited at wasting actual gold.. Surely it can't be that difficult to get it to stick? I also can't burnish the leaves properly (I have tried Q-Tips, just dry brushing, agate after waiting for a day and they go on patchy, or fly off. I think it's because the base isn't fully dry hence burnishing makes a mess, but if it's dry it won't stay tacky. I currently try to go about this by laying instacoll first then adding mona lisa adhesive where leaf won't stick (which is so whack job and I don't like how it almost doesn't dry ever - opposite prob of instacoll) :/ What am I doing wrong?

Offline Estefa

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Re: Gilding – which size do you use and why?
« Reply #47 on: April 12, 2018, 01:52:31 AM »
Hi @Faeleia – you're doing nothing wrong in principal – Instacoll just won't work with imitation leaves, except if you use the »Instacoll Activator«. This is apparently a liquid that you apply on the dry Instacoll and for use with imitation leaves that must be used wet. I just checked the PDF with the instructions and it says so there.

Here's the stuff:

http://www.blattgold.de/Koelner-Instacoll-Activator_detail_37_246.html

Also don't use an agate or other polishing stone with Instacoll (says so in the instructions too). They say you should only gently polish with cotton wool in one direction. They offer a special tissue to do that (I've tried that, it works nicely).

If you need help ordering that stuff from Germany (I know that the shipping costs from that shop to Asia and other non-European countries are outrageous) I can help you and send it from me – much cheaper. Just PM me if you want.
Stefanie :: Website :: Blog :: Instagram

Offline Faeleia

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Re: Gilding – which size do you use and why?
« Reply #48 on: April 12, 2018, 03:43:42 AM »
Ahh, alright, that solves my question! I thought imitation leaves are too thick! I got mine off Amazon and it cost a nice penny by the time it arrived, but I'll wait for my actual gold to arrive and see how it fares. I'll definitely let you know if I need your help to bring this to me! I feel better now cos this has been on my mind for some time now, and I really really want that mirror finish *all the sparkles*

Offline Estefa

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Re: Gilding – which size do you use and why?
« Reply #49 on: April 12, 2018, 05:13:38 AM »
I think it has nothing to do with the thickness, @Faeleia – more with the chemical properties of real gold. Meanwhile I've been at a workshop with Peter Thornton where we learned traditional gilding with gesso, and he explained that only gold is so "sticky". It will stick to itself too, meaning that you can add more layers of gold to your gilding to give it more depth (without adding any more size). You can't do that with Schlagmetall ;).
Stefanie :: Website :: Blog :: Instagram

Offline Faeleia

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Re: Gilding – which size do you use and why?
« Reply #50 on: April 12, 2018, 05:26:53 AM »
I had no idea, that's really important information! I wonder if actual silver leaf will have this characteristic too? I'll also make a mental note to be extra careful if I use loose leaves. If they stick to itself, it sounds like a potential hot mess  ;D

Offline Scarlet Blue

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Re: Gilding – which size do you use and why?
« Reply #51 on: April 12, 2018, 07:54:45 AM »
@Faeleia Real silver doesn't stick to itself and it tarnishes badly.... best to use white gold if you ever want something to look silver.

Offline Estefa

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Re: Gilding – which size do you use and why?
« Reply #52 on: April 12, 2018, 08:33:19 AM »
I had no idea, that's really important information! I wonder if actual silver leaf will have this characteristic too? I'll also make a mental note to be extra careful if I use loose leaves. If they stick to itself, it sounds like a potential hot mess  ;D

Silver doesn't ;). And you're right with the loose gold – it's practically impossible to work with it if you don't have a special brush, like this:

http://www.blattgold.de/Koelner-Gilders-Tip_detail_608_211.html

You can handle the gold with that. A gilder's knife is also useful.

Alternatively you can also try handling the gold with wooden, flat tweezers. Always cut your loose gold CAREFULLY with a clean, sharp scissor the size you'll need for your piece, before you apply it with help of the tweezers. Cut it together with the paper – it won't work without that – it will stick to the scissors as well ;).

This is all just what I learned in Mr. Thornton's workshop – I actually only use patent gold leaf, because the loose gold is too much hussle for me!
Stefanie :: Website :: Blog :: Instagram

Offline LeonieS

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Re: Gilding – which size do you use and why?
« Reply #53 on: June 24, 2018, 12:53:05 AM »
Hi everyone, I am a new member and this is my first post. I have been using the Harvest Crittenden Instacol technique with transfer gold and having good results. However, I would like to know how to apply a second layer of gold.  I did a letter G for my Mum, and because it was stored between the pages of  the watercolour pad  (where I thought it would be safe), it now has a couple of abrasion marks in the stem of the G.  I want to try a second layer, but I am confused about how to adhere it?  I don't have the Instacoll activator as I didn't think I needed to buy it. Any help gratefully received. Here is Australia there are very few people I can ask...Thanks everyone.

Offline jeanwilson

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Re: Gilding – which size do you use and why?
« Reply #54 on: June 25, 2018, 09:54:05 AM »
You might try contacting Jerry Tresser for a suggestion.
His email is at his website
http://www.jtresser.com/

I took a couple workshops with Peter Thornton and he taught us how to *breathe* on the first layer of gold and then quickly put a second layer over the top to fill in little spots.

By *breathe* - I mean open your mouth and get close to the letter and then exhale - as if you were cleaning a pair of glasses - that *huff* that you do when you hold one lens slightly inside your mouth and exhale.

The gold leaf likes to stick to itself - and the exhaled breath leaves just the right amount of moisture.
Loose leaf probably works better than patent (I'm not sure that is the right word? - the kind that is stuck on a carrier sheet)

Just a suggestion - I am by no means an experienced gilder.
Most of what I learned about gilding is that there are a lot of variables. For example, if the humidity went up in the afternoon, our results would be different from what we had in the morning. My advice is to dive in and see what works. There are probably many tutorials on YouTube....

Offline Ergative

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Re: Gilding – which size do you use and why?
« Reply #55 on: June 26, 2018, 03:02:50 AM »
I'm with Jean. I took a workshop once, and one thing that was very clearly emphasized was that gold is the only metal that sticks to itself. So just breathe on your existing layer and put on a second layer, and it should adhere. I've done that successfully--although, now that I think of it, never after a delay of the sort you describe. (In videos I've also seen people take the excess leaf from the edges and rather than brush it off they fold it back onto the letter, where it sticks smoothly. If you burnish it, you don't even get any seams.)

Let us know what happens! I've recently been getting into gilding again myself!
Clara

Offline Estefa

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Re: Gilding – which size do you use and why?
« Reply #56 on: June 26, 2018, 04:44:07 AM »
I think the problem with Instacoll is that it works after a day or so only with an activator (other than real gesso, which can be activated with the blowing method, I learnt that also from Peter Thornton).

While I also learnt that you can fold back the edges on the already sticking gold, that will only work if you have already gold there.

So if the problem is as I understand, that the gold rubbed off and the Instacoll layer is bare, I think only he activator could help :/. But it can't hurt to try and put some more gold on it.

But DON'T use an agate burnisher with Instacoll. It will do no good – it just doesn't work with it. I am no expert regarding traditional gilding, but I've read the instructions about Instacoll from the manufacturer meticulously and they say so. Only use soft cotton, and don't rub – only apply pressure from above. An agate burnisher will only rub off the gold from the acrylic size (happened to me already).
Stefanie :: Website :: Blog :: Instagram