Author Topic: Curv-E Holder - New Oblique Pen Holder  (Read 5868 times)

Offline Erica McPhee

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Curv-E Holder - New Oblique Pen Holder
« on: January 20, 2018, 04:41:27 PM »
While researching for my upcoming book about Flourishing, I completely relearned Engrosser's Script from the old journals and calligraphy masters' lessons. In doing so, I came across this interesting blurb by Charlton V. Howe:

Quote
Personally, I do not think the average oblique holder is well adapted to script writing unless the top side is flattened so the forefinger can rest upon both the holder and the tin at the same time, thus overcoming the tendency to grip or turn. The triangular oblique holder is well adapted to engrossing script.

I have learned through experience that the nearer the point of the pen is grasped, the better control of the pen is the result. In writing Engraverís script, I place my forefinger on the pen below the side piece of the oblique holder about half an inch from the point of the pen, which results in perfect control of my pen.

I was intrigued and researched some more. The only reference to a triangular holder I could find was for the Ransomerian Pen, advertised in many of the old journals.

So I contacted Edward Curran @Edward , one of my favorite pen makers and told him I wanted a curvilateral pen - a somewhat triangular shape but with rounded edges for better comfort, a flat top, and a shallow bottom. I sent him some sketches and photographs of a model I made out of paper clay. After a few trials, Edward created what I think is the perfect holder for Copperplate, and especially flourished Copperplate.

We call it the Curv-E Holder - representing its curvilateral shape, Curran, and E for Erica and Edward.  ;D

I have been using it now for many months and will most likely never go back to a round holder. It allows a natural, comfortable tripod grip which helps me execute both muscular and whole arm movement - both of which facilitate better flourishing. I can glide my hand on either the side of my little finger or the finger nail, whichever feels more comfortable.

I'm sharing some photos below. Would love to hear your thoughts.  ;D
Truly, Erica
Lettering/Design Artist, Homeopath, Photographer, Mom, Wife
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Offline AnasaziWrites

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Re: Curv-E Holder - New Oblique Pen Holder
« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2018, 05:27:33 PM »
Very interesting indeed.
I can also attest that your writing has improved in a major way over the last year.
I'll have a look at these holders.

Offline melanie jane

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Re: Curv-E Holder - New Oblique Pen Holder
« Reply #2 on: January 20, 2018, 05:57:41 PM »
I've often wondered why penmakers don't flatten out the top of turned pens to allow a more comfortable and 'stable' grip.  I generally make ergonomic pens, where the top is already flat, but have also experimented with making similar modifications to a couple of turned pens I've made.  I assumed that there wasn't much demand for them, so didn't bother pursuing it any further - but from my experiments, I agree that it makes a more comfortable pen.

Looking forward to seeing some more.
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Offline Edward

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Re: Curv-E Holder - New Oblique Pen Holder
« Reply #3 on: January 21, 2018, 08:56:57 AM »
Hi All,

Lots of interest in the new (old) penholders. Looking forward to the new book from Erica!

If anyone has any questions about the new pen holders please don't hesitate to ask me or Erica.

Below is a little info on how the pen came about....more in the book I'm sure...I'm sure Erica can add to this too if I've left anything out!

When Erica got in contact about the pen design I was a bit sceptical as I had tried the ergonomic pen holders before and they didn't feel right to me ( I know there are lots of people who love them and swear by them! ), but for me I like the simple round pens. As I learned more about the shape from Erica I began to think there may be something in it, after all the great Madarasz flattened the top of his holders. It was a bit of a trial and error when it came to the over all design, we didn't want a straight triangular shape and we didn't want the intricacies of an ergonomic holder, we really wanted it to be as close as we could get it to what we were used to. The only thing which was 100% nonnegotiable was the triangular element. After many attempts I managed to get a holder which had the elements of both a standard ( for the want of a better word ) and the Ransomerian. On using the pen it felt a little strange at first, but once I got used to it I found it incredibly comfortable to hold. The flat area on top of the pen feels fantastic when executing shades and the pen sits in the hand at exactly the same position every time. When it comes to pen designs everyone has there preferences, thick, thin, short, long, heavy or light, we are just delighted to be able to give penmen one more choice in their search for the perfect pen. I'll be making a few simple Curv-E holders in the near future so if anyone wants to try one just get in contact, let me know your budget and we see if we can get one made for you. Hope this helps clarify the pens a little more and again like I said if you have any questions don't hesitate to ask.

Regards,

Edward

Offline melanie jane

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Re: Curv-E Holder - New Oblique Pen Holder
« Reply #4 on: January 21, 2018, 11:32:02 AM »
Sounds great Edward!  I've also just seen your instagram post showing the design in more detail - there are quite a few changes you've made to a normal pen.  It looks like a happy medium between a traditional turned pen, and a full blown ergonomic.  Well done!

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Offline Edward

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Re: Curv-E Holder - New Oblique Pen Holder
« Reply #5 on: January 21, 2018, 01:15:09 PM »
Thank you Melanie,

It does look very different on the video but thats because I'm trying to show all the angles. It's really just a normal oblique with the grip areas sanded flat. It did take a few goes to get the angles right but well worth it. I'll put up some more images and video which should give everyone a better understanding of the difference.

Edward

Offline Edward

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Re: Curv-E Holder - New Oblique Pen Holder
« Reply #6 on: January 21, 2018, 01:22:58 PM »
One other thing that I think people should understand about designing the new pen is just how much work and time goes into finding a name. Erica and I must have come up with 50 names each....thankfully it was Erica that hit the nail on the head and the Curv-E Holder was born!

Edward


Offline Estefa

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Re: Curv-E Holder - New Oblique Pen Holder
« Reply #7 on: January 21, 2018, 01:57:26 PM »
It looks gorgeous is all I can say :)!
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Offline AAAndrew

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Re: Curv-E Holder - New Oblique Pen Holder
« Reply #8 on: January 21, 2018, 02:44:09 PM »
Very interesting!

Love the blue and white, by the way. Good luck!
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Offline JanisTX

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Re: Curv-E Holder - New Oblique Pen Holder
« Reply #9 on: January 21, 2018, 04:33:23 PM »
I'm dying to try that holder!

Janis

Offline melanie jane

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Re: Curv-E Holder - New Oblique Pen Holder
« Reply #10 on: January 21, 2018, 05:22:38 PM »
One other thing that I think people should understand about designing the new pen is just how much work and time goes into finding a name. Erica and I must have come up with 50 names each....thankfully it was Erica that hit the nail on the head and the Curv-E Holder was born!

Edward

Haha, always the hardest bit when starting a business too!  ::)
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Offline Empty_of_Clouds

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Re: Curv-E Holder - New Oblique Pen Holder
« Reply #11 on: January 23, 2018, 04:35:54 AM »
Interesting design.  I have an ergonomic holder from Melanie (EnglishPenCrafts) that feels in my hand exactly the way the holder in this thread is described.  It's not triangular.  It is kind of like a free-form Tower Strahm holder.  The upper surface of the grip is flat (and dipping slightly), and the thumb sits behind the flange also on a flat plane.  The side that is hidden by the hand is curved - though as this plays little part in the holding it is not so relevant beyond aesthetics.

This image doesn't show those planes as clearly as I would like.


Offline Vlatorn

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Re: Curv-E Holder - New Oblique Pen Holder
« Reply #12 on: March 02, 2018, 06:38:21 AM »
Hi All,

Lots of interest in the new (old) penholders. Looking forward to the new book from Erica!

If anyone has any questions about the new pen holders please don't hesitate to ask me or Erica.

Below is a little info on how the pen came about....more in the book I'm sure...I'm sure Erica can add to this too if I've left anything out!

When Erica got in contact about the pen design I was a bit sceptical as I had tried the ergonomic pen holders before and they didn't feel right to me ( I know there are lots of people who love them and swear by them! ), but for me I like the simple round pens. As I learned more about the shape from Erica I began to think there may be something in it, after all the great Madarasz flattened the top of his holders. It was a bit of a trial and error when it came to the over all design, we didn't want a straight triangular shape and we didn't want the intricacies of an ergonomic holder, we really wanted it to be as close as we could get it to what we were used to. The only thing which was 100% nonnegotiable was the triangular element. After many attempts I managed to get a holder which had the elements of both a standard ( for the want of a better word ) and the Ransomerian. On using the pen it felt a little strange at first, but once I got used to it I found it incredibly comfortable to hold. The flat area on top of the pen feels fantastic when executing shades and the pen sits in the hand at exactly the same position every time. When it comes to pen designs everyone has there preferences, thick, thin, short, long, heavy or light, we are just delighted to be able to give penmen one more choice in their search for the perfect pen. I'll be making a few simple Curv-E holders in the near future so if anyone wants to try one just get in contact, let me know your budget and we see if we can get one made for you. Hope this helps clarify the pens a little more and again like I said if you have any questions don't hesitate to ask.

Regards,

Edward

Wauw @Erica McPhee and @Edward super interesting!! Iím a lefty and using a right oblique, Iíd love to see how this penholder would fit when holding left handed. I find that I fiddle a bit getting the right hold with my current holder, and your ideas are very appealing.
Lemme know if you need a lefty tester - Iíd love to help out

Offline Edward

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Re: Curv-E Holder - New Oblique Pen Holder
« Reply #13 on: March 02, 2018, 06:51:01 AM »
Hi Vlatorn,

It's something I'm looking into at the moment, lefty's using right-handed pens throws up a few problems. Firstly the flange will hamper the middle finger from extending towards the top of the pen, and secondly the index finger is parallel with the flange as apposed to meeting it at an angle. These are not huge problems but the design will need tweaking to get it right!

Do you use a tripod grip using the right-handed pen?

Edward

Offline Vlatorn

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Re: Curv-E Holder - New Oblique Pen Holder
« Reply #14 on: March 04, 2018, 06:10:06 PM »
Hi Vlatorn,

It's something I'm looking into at the moment, lefty's using right-handed pens throws up a few problems. Firstly the flange will hamper the middle finger from extending towards the top of the pen, and secondly the index finger is parallel with the flange as apposed to meeting it at an angle. These are not huge problems but the design will need tweaking to get it right!

Do you use a tripod grip using the right-handed pen?

Edward

Hi Edward
I do not use a tripod grip. I have a somewhat dark video on my Instagram where you can see my grip. Iíd be happy to do some better videos for you to see how Iím gripping if that could be interesting?